Podcasts suggestions: what are you listening to?

Loved what Anand Giridharadas had to say about building a movement on this podcast episode. Do you agree?

These people on the fascist side of the equation in America, have, let’s be honest, built an extraordinary movement. They have. They’ve built a movement that makes people feel at home, provides a sense of exuberance and excitement, that has created real feelings–that has met human beings in the kind of reptile brain place where we all are, frankly. And-- Those of us who want a future of democracy and justice and human rights for all, we have not built as good of a movement as their movement. Our movement is more righteous-- what it wants is good. What that fascist movement wants is bad, let’s be very clear, but if you’re just objectively assessing the quality of these movements-- the pro-democracy movement is inferior right now. It has not created that sense of home and belonging. It has no strategy for transcendence and emotion. It doesn’t really have an astute psychological understanding of what moves voters. Its messaging is bonkers. It constantly hues to this old notion of persuading through diluting what you stand for–
leaving everybody kind of cold. And so, praying for rain to save us from fascism is not going to work. we need to organize a better, more magnanimous, more fiery, more angry, more humane, more loving movement. All of these things in one if we have a chance of saving the country.

Full episode

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I’ve had this discussion a lot over the years. I usually frame it as a difference in narrative building (rather than movement building). E.g. if you don’t have the story right, you can’t build the movement.

So on the one hand, I agree, the right has created a sense of belonging and have created narratives that truly engage people. The problem is that the vast majority of those narratives are mis/disinformation and outright lies. Also, I don’t understand this “old notion of persuading through diluting what you stand for–leaving everybody kind of cold”. Guess I’ll have to listen to the whole episode!

It also reminds me of this podcast episode we recorded a while ago. Our guest was Kudzayi Ngwerume, a social impact enthusiast, and we talked movement building through creativity and passion.

I have listened to the episode and I believe it CAN be used as inspiration. I truelly believe that.
But I also believe that we - by this communication platform - have to guide and inspire people.
It’s similair to putting 22 persons in a lawn. They will not start to play soccer unless you explain what you want them to do.

As said in the episode, it is important to have some knowledge and some understanding of the history. As in “One foot in the future, one foot in the history and the heart in the present.”
What we have in Sweden just now is two feet in the future and a lot of work with estinguishing fires. And a common feeling is that we are the victims. As if we all are innocent.

I like this Ego Eco picture that I don’ know who invented. But uf you search for Ego Eco you find ther are more than one . And as I see it, the ego is about competing, about unequality, building hierachies by using catogories etc. Eco on the other hand is about being a part of a much bigger context, about democracy, taking care of each other and the planet etc.

I can imagen Ego Eco as two different world views, and the dominating one just now is ego. But we all find our selfes in situations where we have to choose between them from time to time - so we all can behave both ways. Especially when we are in a hurry.

The episode withAnand is about USA, but every country has made a transition to the economy we all are part of just now. (I know details about how the transition to New Public Management, economic groth and globalisation progressed in Sweden due to the support we need for our son with a disability. )

This is something we need to use WEAll Together, this communication platform, for. We can learn a lot from each other. How the transition was actually done. 200 countries, 200 different stories. 300 municipalities in Sweden, 300 different stories. We need to start to talk about the transition that has already taken place. The transition that now forms our envirement, no matter where you live on this earth. The transition to global economy.

What actually happened in Sweden (from the last years of the 90-ties) was that democracy was put on hold. And it is still put on hold. And we all got into the
Ego-competition world view - in order to get a job or keep a job. No matter of what we thought about it. And now we are stuck with competion and with individualism, stress and mental illness. But it was also 1976 here in Sweden a price in economics was awarded to the neoliberalist Milton Friedman. And soon economics became not only a science but also regarded as a very important science. Perhaps the moooost important science? So, now you find it in the top of the ego hierarchy.

Yes. We need a new economy, but we also need to talk about what democracy is. It is not just about having a vote. It’s also about being listened to. And to have time and interest to listen to others. Because time is also an issue when we talk about democracy and different world views - as in Ego Eco. And I like these three sentences:

Never stop being astonished about your body
Never stop being astonished about the planet you live on
Always check that the communication works

I am looking forward to keep on discussing how we can guide and inspire the communications in the WEAll platform. And I find WEAll as a very good abbrivation for Wellbeing Economic Alliance and WEAll Together as an equally good name for the communication platform.

Best regards


Thanks for engaging Laura. I will check out your podcast.

Yes. Narrative is a major part. Also, clear intention that collaborating is key.

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I love that illustration, Anne.

A friend of mine in Brazil recently told me that we need to stop focusing on democracy. We don’t live for democracy. We need to create a lifeocracy - with life as the focal point.

Hello Laura
I think we have to question this right and left thinking and I think that centralisation is ruining the democrocy regardless if it is “left” or “right”.

There is a saying that “Where money is, they rule”. And usually the right wing is about money and ownership, business and being successfull in these areas.
So, what do we have on the left wing? Typically earlier - the people who worked for the right wing people.

But what happens when more and more people in the world becomes middle income people? Who also invest in real estate and shares. So, what have the “left wing” to offer the growing middle income group?

An alternative is that you change the deep rooted left-right model and start to use the Ego Eco picture instead. How can you now pursiade people that Eco is something else than Eco? What is Eco about? Equality? Building relations and networks, local sociaties, including people in decisions??? And what is Ego about? Getting famouse, rich, powerful, climbing upwords, competition? Or in other words - Ego are things and people who want to grow very big on other things and peoples expence. As the media market, the advertising market, the market for violence as amusement, and a lot of other markets.

How can we now pursuade more people to think Eco? By talking about these two world views. And to explain the difficulties to understand each other when people have this different world views. Start to talk about the historical change to Ego that have been done since the 80-ties, started by Thatcher and Reagan that is called neoliberalism. Which have been extended to a global economy at the expence of global health and the global envirement/nature.
That is what I think.
Best regards

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I don’t know about you, but all the heat and disasters were making me feel like we waited too long and it was all doom and gloom. This interview by James Carville taught me quite a few things and helped me renew my strength for another push forward.

Politics War Room with James Carville & Al Hunt / Al Gore: Climate CrisisAl Gore

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Thanks for sharing, I have been listening to this one over the last few days that has made me think about the connection between the economic system, climate and the lasting effects of imperialism.